Re: [UUPoly-L] Perhaps there is some truth in your statment.

Anarchamama <anarchamama@yahoo.com> · Tue, 03 Jul 2007 19:17:32 -0000

I think these are important points. I studied gender a bit several years ago before I followed a different path. I have been committed to raising my children gender free or as close to it as possible. However, my youngest son demonstrates stereotypical male behavior no matter how much I try to alter his environment. As does my daughter. She loves dresses and "girly" stuff. Again, I attempted to alter her environment. To what I attribute their self expression I don't know. I am not going to call it genetic though. It is puzzling as they showed these preferences long before school and their parents are not subscribing to stereotypical gender roles. My firstborn is more in the middle of the spectrum but claims himself as heterosexual. he is 16. He is soft, has long hair but loves to skateboard and drum.

What I think is important to address in this though is the fact that we attach labels to behavior and preferences. High activity, sports, cars, aggression is labeled as male while pink, feminine, dresses, domesticity, nurturing is labeled as female. My girl is nurturing but also very aggressive. She loves dresses and babies but loves to explore and get dirty. She loves control and problem solving and is top of her class in Math. My son loves cars, clothes with cars, is social but not as attached to control and problem solving. He loves to dream and tell stories. How do we attach labels to that?

I learned form my last two children to let go of the labels and accept them for who they are and what they prefer. Only when it becomes oppressive or has the potential to do so will I step in. All 3 of my children know that they can love whomever they want and how ever many people. 

I tend to see all of these things along with sexuality, sexual preferences and gender along a fluid continuum.

Cheers,
Cecily
Northern CA

PDX Couple <pdx-couple@comcast.net> wrote: Hi Keith

I think your statement has some truth.  But it is not complete.  Yes 
environment and culture has some components but so do genes.

I have seen very aggressive two year old boys.  I have observed very mild 
two year old boys.  I have observed some aggressive girls but more 
non-aggressive girls.  Raising children and teach in RE classes show you the 
wide range of behaviors long before environments and cultures have kicked 
in.  Mothers tell about very active little boys before they are born.  Same 
with unborn girls.  And in real life that behavior continues.

Thank you for your insights.  Yes truth has many forms and different 
manifestations.

Doug
Portland, OR

>  I came up with a theory recently that I'm quite fond of, though I don't
> have the knowledge to even suggest it's born out by any research - anyway:
> I figure we're all born, very simply, as sexual.  Not hetero-, not guy or
> lesbian, not bi-.  What we learn as we grow and are brainwashed by culture
> is the expectations and rules of our environment. We learn how boys and
> girls are "supposed" to act and feel from our environment, and most of us
> accept that, even if it isn't quite what we feel inside.  It's peer
> pressure, and we conform.
> If we are in a particularly accepting community and family, we may have
> more flexibility, we may be accepting of others or our own desires to be
> openly other-than-heterosexual, but it takes quite a personality to fight
> that compulsion to conform.
> For myself, I have always identified as heterosexual, and still do at the
> age of 45, but I'm noting a softening of my assumption that I am only
> interested in women. I doubt I will ever move toward bisexuality, but I
> cannot say that it is impossible.  As I've become more comfortable with my
> own sexuality, I find the boundaries are less clear than I've always
> assumed.
> So in summary, I think sexual orientation is both chemical and a learned
> behavior, and that sometimes we learn what our culture teaches, not what 
> our
> chemistry would choose if left to its own devices.
> Comments?
> Best - Keith
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> "It is a mistake to believe that God is primarily concerned with 
> religion."
>
>
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Cecily Arenas, RN, MSN, CNL

See my Triathlon/travel blog:
http://www.birthing-journey.blogspot.com

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