[UUPoly-L] Gay, straight, bi?. And does the label matter?

Bear said:

I dunno.  When confronted with a question about someone's
gender preference, I basically think of a very small set of
questions.  And any subset of these questions can have yes
answers.

A: (sexually) Likes Men?
B: (sexually) Likes Women?
C: Willing to take relationships with men seriously?
D: Willing to take relationships with women seriously?

Hang on, is not the gender of the person who does the liking relevant? I may say that I A.) like Men, and D). am willing to take a relationship with a man seriously, but whether I am a woman or a man makes all the difference as to my "sexual orientation," which I acknowledge I was using interchangeably here with "gender preference."

As for those who pointed out that I missed mentioning intersex folks, you are right of course, and it's not because I forgot, it's because I hadn't gotten to that before I had to finish up my posting and turn my attention elsewhere. I was counting on someone to raise it, and I did. So......in the case of an intersex person whose sexual preference I'm looking at, I'd start with how the intersex person identifies (male or female) and from there on out label his or her preference by the same three criteria (attraction, behavior and self-identity). As for the non intersex person attracted to or having a sexual relationship with an intersex person, it gets too complicated for my simple brain to handle, so I guess I'd just ask that person how they would label their sexual orientation or gender preference, and go with that.

Come to think of it, perhaps we should dump all this labeling of others, or allowing others to label us, as it so rarely, if ever, useful. If I have to stretch my ability to be accepting in order to be compassionate or loving to a person who insists he or she is straight, even though my judgement (based on all the evidence I can find) is that he or she is gay or bisexual, that is good. Let me be challenged to stretch and to love at the same time.

I still find the details of the many ways that gender preference/sexual orientation manifests in the real world fascinating. However, I now realized that I may have fueled the fires of judgement and distancing by jumping into the fray of categorization. Can I take it all back?

Note to self: Don't do that again OR look before you leap OR consider context before reacting.
Note to my note: In the instance that started this thread, does it really help the poster deal with her relationship issues if she, or any of us, believes that her partner is....or is not.....gay. I don't think so, and I wish I had said that instead.

Joani


There are corresponding questions about whether they prefer
transsexuals, intersexed or neuter folk, but not being of
any of those persuasions, nor ever called upon to play
matchmaker for someone who is, they are not questions I need
to ask.

Questions about being "out" fall more under honesty and
self-respect than gender preference as far as I'm concerned.

If behavior is different from gender preference, and it's
not due to special circumstances arising from their life and
current relationships, then I think it's a huge warning sign
under general personality integration rather than an aspect
of gender preference.  For example, someone who likes men
but has made a commitment to be monogamous in a relationship
with a woman, I understand (and empathize with -- been
there, on the opposite side of the coin).  Someone who is
sexually attracted to a given gender but would never have
sex with one because s/he doesn't respect them - or for
some other such "internal" reason - I would consider myself
warned of a broken personality when I discovered that about
someone, which IMO is far more important than someone's
gender preference.

                   Bear


Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
From: "faraze waqar" <farazester@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [UUPoly-L] gay, straight or bi
Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 11:36:43 +0500
To: uupoly-l@uupa.org
References: <mailman.24.1199725208.6931.uupoly-l@uupa.org>
        <6.2.3.4.2.20080108190929.06880480@pop.lmi.net>
        <Pine.LNX.4.53.0801101726050.28910@www.pagansexcult.org>
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.53.0801101726050.28910@www.pagansexcult.org>
Reply-To: uupoly-l@uupa.org
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Message: 3

like to know u guys

On Jan 11, 2008 6:46 AM, <bear@pagansexcult.org> wrote:

>
>
> I dunno.  When confronted with a question about someone's
> gender preference, I basically think of a very small set of
> questions.  And any subset of these questions can have yes
> answers.
>
> A: (sexually) Likes Men?
> B: (sexually) Likes Women?
> C: Willing to take relationships with men seriously?
> D: Willing to take relationships with women seriously?
>
> There are corresponding questions about whether they prefer
> transsexuals, intersexed or neuter folk, but not being of
> any of those persuasions, nor ever called upon to play
> matchmaker for someone who is, they are not questions I need
> to ask.
>
> Questions about being "out" fall more under honesty and
> self-respect than gender preference as far as I'm concerned.
>
> If behavior is different from gender preference, and it's
> not due to special circumstances arising from their life and
> current relationships, then I think it's a huge warning sign
> under general personality integration rather than an aspect
> of gender preference.  For example, someone who likes men
> but has made a commitment to be monogamous in a relationship
> with a woman, I understand (and empathize with -- been
> there, on the opposite side of the coin).  Someone who is
> sexually attracted to a given gender but would never have
> sex with one because s/he doesn't respect them - or for
> some other such "internal" reason - I would consider myself
> warned of a broken personality when I discovered that about
> someone, which IMO is far more important than someone's
> gender preference.
>
>                   Bear
>  _______________________________________________
> The UUPoly-L mailing list has public archives.
> Please keep that in mind when deciding how much to reveal about yourself.
> UUPoly-L mailing list
> UUPoly-L@uupa.org
> http://www.uupa.org/mailman/listinfo/uupoly-l
>


_______________________________________________
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Joani Blank
land line : 510-834-7399 (preferred)
cell: 510-387-1315
joani@swansway.com


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